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UVB Light - its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 7:51 pm
by rcteem
After reading into this in Marcus, mworks, thread with his histos and how he used uvb bulbs as a "basking lamp" for about 45 min a day or week, cant remember. I decided to do this little experiment myself and found it to be quite useful. All my frogs come out to the open and bask in the light. Its like they know that it is beneficial. All my auratus, tincs, pumilio, and thumbnails come out and bask. It is so cool to watch. I even place a UVB bulb over one of my tadpole tanks and the froglets came out with a lot brighter color.

I was curious to see if anyone else has played with this and their results from using UVB bulbs ? I hope to hear from other from some other froggers on this subject.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:30 pm
by D3monic
What kind of UVB did you use? I have been wanting to try this myself.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:38 pm
by rcteem
Exo terra 5.0 UVB bulb, not the tube one

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:42 pm
by rcteem
try it out and be sure to post your findings!!!

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 8:49 pm
by D3monic
I am pretty sure I have one of those laying around. When i first set up my Varadero tank I had a 2.0 and 5.0 in the fixture. Everyone started jumping all over my case insisting that dart frogs dont need UVB and that I should change it....

I will be sure to post what I find.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 9:11 pm
by Philsuma
The U.K guys are all big on UVB for dart frogs.

Having been to Costa Rica and observed pumilio and auratus in situ....I can say that I did not witness any "basking" behaviour. Heck direct "hard" sunlight hardly reaches thru the canopy in most places. I'm wondering if some people are hooked on UVB and the relationship with Darts chiefly because the frogs are diurnal.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 9:27 pm
by Azurel
Phelsuma wrote:The U.K guys are all big on UVB for dart frogs.

Having been to Costa Rica and observed pumilio and auratus in situ....I can say that I did not witness any "basking" behaviour. Heck direct "hard" sunlight hardly reaches thru the canopy in most places. I'm wondering if some people are hooked on UVB and the relationship with Darts chiefly because the frogs are diurnal.



In situ could it be they do not need to bask since the UVB is readily available wither or not that we can fully see sunlight threw the canopy so basking is a captive trait. I mean we really cannot compare the lighting(CFLs) we use for this hobby to the sun. Hell they are ever trying to advance lighting in the reef hobby and are no where close to simulating actual sunlight for reefs and corals when it come to lighting the marine hobby is years in advancement, but again I don't really thing we need that advanced of lighting for our vivs. But the addition of UVB could very well have a benefit long term....

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Tue May 31, 2011 11:39 pm
by jeffr
The glass will filter out the UV though. You need to set your tops up where you have some type of screen or you have to buy the glass (forgot the name that allows UV to pass through

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 8:01 am
by Azurel
Starphire Glass...Low iron.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 10:28 am
by D3monic
Does acrylic perform the same kind of filtering of UV? I think in EU they call the low iron glass something else. I know if I was to fork out that kind of money for it I would be using it for the front of the tank not the top!

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:04 am
by Azurel
Yea I wouldn't waste the money for the top, but a side or 2 wouldn't hurt and you could shine the light in that way. I know Marcus does his from the side through the front glass. Think acrylic does filter out most of the UVB and some UVA wavelengths to it's dentriment. I think if I remember correctly that it will cause it to color over time to a yellowish color....But there are differant levels/qualities that you can get acrylic/lexan in. When I built my corner tank I had them use Museaum grade acrylic that filtered out 100% of UVA/UVB lighting and it would not color the acrylic at least over a much longer period.....It also cost a bit more....

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:12 am
by rcteem
D3monic wrote:Does acrylic perform the same kind of filtering of UV? I think in EU they call the low iron glass something else. I know if I was to fork out that kind of money for it I would be using it for the front of the tank not the top!


This is exactly what I did...I used a clamp and hung it down to the front viv. As far as over the tadpoles, I had no top and had direct light over it. Its amazing how bright your offspring's color comes out!!!

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:14 am
by Philsuma
rcteem wrote:
D3monic wrote: Its amazing how bright your offspring's color comes out!!!


Chris...what exactly do you mean by this statement ?

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:19 am
by rcteem
Philsuma wrote:The U.K guys are all big on UVB for dart frogs.

Having been to Costa Rica and observed pumilio and auratus in situ....I can say that I did not witness any "basking" behaviour. Heck direct "hard" sunlight hardly reaches thru the canopy in most places. I'm wondering if some people are hooked on UVB and the relationship with Darts chiefly because the frogs are diurnal.


Phil, I have to disagree with you on this. Visiting Peru, Brazil, Columbia, and just recently Panama there is a good amout of light that gets though the leaves then we imagine. Though direct sunlight doesnt hit the forest floor, I find it hard to believe that UVB and other nutrients get filtered out 100% through the canopy's leaves. Just food for thought but I dont see how leaves can filter out more nutrients then glass. For example, look at how people experience darker colors on there froglets when there tank is over grown and the tadpoles were tank raised.

Anyways, not trying to create a debate as I dont have scientific facts, just sharing with the hobby my observations.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:21 am
by rcteem
Philsuma wrote:
rcteem wrote:
D3monic wrote: Its amazing how bright your offspring's color comes out!!!


Chris...what exactly do you mean by this statement ?


My froglets have been morphing out with a lot brighter colors... Oranges are bright orange instead of a dull yellowish/ orange. My standards came out with a metallic yellow color vs a dull yellow that they morphed out before...etc etc. See my post above about another comment. Ill try to post pictures up later on tonight to show you the difference.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 11:54 am
by D3monic
Is there any known side effects from long term exposure to UV in dart frogs? I wish Ed was a regular here, I will have to do some digging on Google scholar when I get a chance and see if any decent studies that have been done.

Otherwise we may need to do our own little experiment here. If I had enough room for two tadpole bins I would try lighting half with a standard 2.0 bulb and the other with 5.0 and see if there was indeed a difference. maybe I can divide my bin and give it a try as long as it doesnt make things too hot.

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 12:05 pm
by Philsuma
Chris,

We NEED to have a debate on this. There are no experts here and I seriously doubt we are going to find an academic peer reviewed paper on this topic, so.......good ole fashioned hobbyists posting their experiences and opinions is PLENTY good enough for me at this point.

Try to take a picture of your Set up too, Chris. Your bulbs and fixtures and position of same / distance ect to the tadpoles.

I don't doubt that UVB and sunlight reach the canopy floor in some areas - it HAS to as the jungle topography is certainly varied, but my question is - Do Dart Frogs truly "Bask" ? Are they SEEKING out these high lighted areas for direct benefit ?

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Wed Jun 01, 2011 12:15 pm
by Philsuma
It may be time to invest in a Solarmeter !

http://www.lightyourreptiles.com/solarmeter62.html

I love my P.E infrared temp gun with frickin laser beam, so naturally I'll NEED to get UVB so I can justify buying another frog room toy ! :twisted:

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 1:23 am
by dendroworks
Here's a photo of my Redheads 'sunbathing'! I use a 10% UVb bulb once a week on all my vivs now - the frogs know when they have had enough and leave after between 20 - 40mins. All my frogs come out and sunbathe - some do it quite sneakily too. The light is shone through the front glass doors of the vivs (all of which are Optiwhite low iron glass) and most frogs will come right to the front of the viv - around 6 inches from the bulb at first then slowly work their way back from ituntill they have had enough

Image

I have definately seen a colouring up of some species (BriBri, Colon, whitefoot and redhead being the most noticable). I think there are benefits for the frogs, many which we probably don't have a clue about so will continue to use it.

Regards
Marcus

Re: UVB and its pros/ cons

Posted: Thu Jun 02, 2011 9:48 am
by Girlwithafrogtattoo
This sounds like it's going to be a good experiment! I look forward to seeing what you all find.